Brown Fail

[TomiT14]

D doesn't "hate" dave, he just got hurt by him, he felt like dave just quit on them, which he pretty much did. So I guess you could call it tension/resentment instead of hate/anger. dave is a great guy and super talented, but that was kind of a punch to the gut to the guys. Tom is really cool and super talented as well, I think it worked out for the best. Dave is in another band having fun and the guys love Tom.

I agree completely. I never said Deryck hates him, but he wouldn't want him back anymore.
It was a big punch in the face by Dave, so Deryck hasn't forgiven it to him.
Also, Tom isn't leaving either. He's now part of the band, want it or not, so I don't see him leaving any time soon.

[FuckT41182]

would you be happier if Dave was with Sums now ??even if he didn't like the music and Deryck once said that he was to only one who never called and shit like this ...

Not arguing, but i never said i was not happy with Tom being there. I never said i did not like tom, either. There is just solid evidence that Dave is better at the guitar, than Tom. Also, and i left this out in my last post, he didn't save the band. Even if Tom said no, there would still be a Sum 41, just with a different guitarist.

I didn't mean you ...I meant the guy who wrote that Tom fails or the others who are always complaining :)

[Jesus Christ Supermarket]

Tom's awesome. If you don't like him, Fuck Off and go listen to something else.

[Emil]

I can undestand why Dave left, and he left after he heard that deryck wnated to go back to the poppier style. Imagine being a heavy metal kid who writes really great riffs and solos to go back and play threechord pop-songs. Makes sense to me.

[marcus10]

Tom is good but why he doesn´t sing as better as he sings in gob?

[FuckT41182]

Tom is good but why he doesn´t sing as better as he sings in gob?

I would say it's because Sum 41 is different from Gob...I just think Dave's voice fitted in better than Tom's voice ...like in TNS acoustic version ...

[Mitchell]

Tom is starting to get used to singing in Sum 41 he sings way better now than he did in 2007

[Jake-41]

I can undestand why Dave left, and he left after he heard that deryck wnated to go back to the poppier style. Imagine being a heavy metal kid who writes really great riffs and solos to go back and play threechord pop-songs. Makes sense to me.

No, it makes no sense. If he was a true friend to Deryck, Steve, and Cone. He'd be there if they were playing bluegrass.

[Heather]

I don't think it was the fact that he left the band, its how he left..without warning and abruptly. I think D really needed to write UH, for personal and musical reasons, but Dave didn't want anything to do with the album. And I think D took it as a personal blow since the album was about his life. thats just my opinion

[Lars]

Without warning?

Maybe to us, fans.

But I remember Deryck stating that they were already afraid he would leave as soon as they released AKNF.

[Mitchell]

They realized a year or maybe two before he left that he wasn't happy in Sum 41

[Jeremy Kill]

I can undestand why Dave left, and he left after he heard that deryck wnated to go back to the poppier style. Imagine being a heavy metal kid who writes really great riffs and solos to go back and play threechord pop-songs. Makes sense to me.

No, it makes no sense. If he was a true friend to Deryck, Steve, and Cone. He'd be there if they were playing bluegrass.

It makes perfect sense.

Dave left simply because Deryck was doing everything. Dave left saying he, "couldn't express himself properly with a guitar." Making Underclass Hero was the straw that broke the camel's back. Why else would Dave have stayed for so long if the band themselves (mainly Deryck) said that they knew he was going to leave after they made All Killer No Filler? They were getting heavier and Dave was able to have a little outlet for his creativity by writing solos. That's not to say that's the only thing he ever did in the band, but after seeing how Deryck works in the studio with Cone, I can kind of see and understand it now.

Even in a recent interview Deryck was joking about how there's a "control freak" in him and Stevo or Cone comment on how that's why Dave left. It may have been a joke at the time, but there's probably some truth to it.

Dave was great friends with the band and probably still is with the exception of Deryck. But Dave's a musician and when your creative talent is getting stifled because it doesn't fit another member's vision and that member has veto over what you have to say because they're the frontman and the main songwriter, then you have no choice but to leave. It would have been stupid for Dave to stay with Sum 41 if he wasn't happy. Dave is the kind of person who doesn't care about fame or fortune (even though money is something nice to have every once in a while). But he would rather be in bands that allow him to be creative than be in famous bands that tell him what he should play.

It wasn't about the quality of friendship, it was about the mechanics of the band.

[Jake-41]

Yeah, but Deryck probably went out of his way, to make two pretty heavy albums. He did this, because he knows he has a great lead guitarist who deserves to show his skill. I don't understand how it would have sucked so bad. He would have only had to play about 3 songs from that album live, and i'm sure it would have been a little heavier if he was still in command of the guitar. Without him, there was nobody to say, hey, this sounds like shit. Sometimes to much freedom is bad.

[Jeremy Kill]

Yeah, but Deryck probably went out of his way, to make two pretty heavy albums. He did this, because he knows he has a great lead guitarist who deserves to show his skill. I don't understand how it would have sucked so bad. He would have only had to play about 3 songs from that album live, and i'm sure it would have been a little heavier if he was still in command of the guitar. Without him, there was nobody to say, hey, this sounds like shit. Sometimes to much freedom is bad.

He did. Deryck said himself that he, "tried to write songs he thought Dave would like to play."

Don't you see anything wrong with that statement? Why doesn't he just let Dave write what he wants to play and then the two of them work it out together? Why is it always Deryck writing riffs for him?

Why do side-projects exist? Whoever starts them has a need to express a creative side that they can't express in their main band. Dave and Vaughn started Brown Brigade around the time Does This Look Infected? was released.

Dave also said that the songs were getting too easy to play. Could you imagine going up on stage playing songs you didn't enjoy playing anymore? Dave just wasn't happy and I don't know why they didn't try to work things out.

[Simon]

Without him, there was nobody to say, hey, this sounds like shit. Sometimes to much freedom is bad.

I kind of agree with that, but I think Deryck needed this freedom for UH and Dave wasn't willing to play along.

I think we shouldn't read too much into this. They all expressed their feelings more than enough. Dave left them in a crucial moment without a warning (I remember they all said on different occasions: He just called one day and said that he didn't want to be in the band anymore because he wanted to do his own thing, which is okay). I don't think Deryck is mad at him for that decision, he was just disappointed that Dave did not adress this earlier, so they could've worked something out together like friends do. It just seemed selfish. But Dave felt like it was time to do this and that they would be able to create another great record without him while Deryck wasn't even sure if they would be able to exist as a band anymore. It was the typical songwriter insecurity issue paired with bad human communication and I think we should be thankful that things turned out so good for all of them and us.

And please, let's stop this now. There is no need for this discussion over and over again whenever some idiot comes along and bashes Tom (seriously or not, doesn't really matter).

I just thought it was funny that Tom finally screwed up a guitar part, because it seemed like he never makes mistakes guitar-wise.

[Mitchell]

even dave made mistakes

[Jake-41]

Just let the record show that i completely support, and love Tom. But now it just seems like we should just call this whole fucking band "Deryck". He decides everything about anything.

Not to say that's bad. I like good music, and if he can make that, great. I know Cone and Tom both wrote songs for this new album, but you know it's all up to Deryck if it's any good. And if it's not, he's gonna tweak it into something of his own, if it's going on the record, that is. I mean, has anyone really thought about it? That being, everybody that has been slightly over, over in the way of Deryck making music, has disappeared. Deryck wants to run the show, he IS and will forever be Sum 41. If you don't like, or agree with that, he couldn't care less. Maybe that's why i adore this band so much, i dunno. All i know is that together, they make a group of what seems to be some great guys.

EDIT: Can somebody show me a Dave mistake? I'm not saying he never made one, but i just wanna see one. And Jeremy, in about 6 years, don't you think these songs will be too easy for Tom? Even the hardest song is easy after you play a couple hundred times a year.

[Mitchell]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDF2ZBUG ... kP1aV9zh64

This wasn't really a mistake but It wasn't how it was supposed to be at 0:50
I coincidentally saw this today and it was the first I could think of..
I will post a real fail tomorrow

[Jake-41]

Didn't really affect the song, and i couldn't tell when i listened without looking, so no real fail there. But yeah, i dunno why he did that. It indeed looked unintentional.

[Jeremy Kill]

EDIT: Can somebody show me a Dave mistake? I'm not saying he never made one, but i just wanna see one. And Jeremy, in about 6 years, don't you think these songs will be too easy for Tom? Even the hardest song is easy after you play a couple hundred times a year.

I'm sure if you watch enough performances of Still Waiting you'll hear Dave off one of the the octaves. Though I don't know about any big mistake that Dave's done.

Regarding the easiness of songs, it's all about who plays them. During live performances, Tom already looked bored playing Underclass Hero songs. I remember him saying in an interview that Does This Look Infected? was a fun album to play and Underclass Hero was a good album to listen to.

The bottom line is that Dave wanted to play metal. Sum 41 wasn't metal enough and wasn't going further into the metal genre when they discussed in Vegas that they were going to do another pop-punk album (now known as Underclass Hero).