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I agree. while I dont think Underclass Hero sucked, I do think it was weak, and their worst album.

they were missing a lot, but Deryck had things he needed to get off his chest and write about, and I think they were trying to recover from Dave leaving, and Creig Nori leaving too.

I do miss the old sound of their songs, just all around the old music was much better; the songs, the guitar, the band.

They need Greig back, definitely! If not Dave... what can still save them without Dave is a good producer like Greig, and if not Greig, they need someone really good. I would suggest others that they worked with before, like Jerry Finn, who did a great job on AKNF but... we all know... RIP Jerry.

They should still find some good producer. Kinda like Billy Talent are working now with Brendan O'Brien, so it should be freakin' awesome, I mean, Brendan O'Brien worked with such big artists as Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, Bruce Springsteen, Rage Against The Machine, Velvet Revolver, The Offspring, Stone Temple Pilots, and more. I mean, with such a producer, The Sums could also do really great! So they should get a real producer like that.

Hentaiman wrote: they should get a real producer

agreed. Deryck just doesn't have enough practice and i don't think he should practice on Sum 41 songs.

fenderrocks wrote:Well my first Sum41 experience Pieces and Chuck and I liked it and got the other albums, but when UH came out thats when I really got into it, I like the vibe, and I listened to them before green day so I never made the connection, still don't.

Same here, except I listened to American Idiot first, then slowly got into Chuck which was nothing like American Idiot, then when Underclass Hero came around I did not compare it to Green Day at all

for those of you who don't think UH sounds like AI (even the slightest) seriously need their ears checked. letterbomb and take a look at yourself are clones.

oh and about not selling out shows, i bought my tickets about a week to 2 weeks before it was gonna happen and i still got seats about half way down the arena. really good seats. seat that would get you a good view and not-so-distorted sound.

2712 wrote:for those of you who don't think UH sounds like AI (even the slightest) seriously need their ears checked. letterbomb and take a look at yourself are clones.

Yeah, it's not hard to see the solo to Underclass Hero was influenced by the solo of American Idiot. As I've said before, Walking Disaster is basically the story behind American Idiot in a nutshell.

And I agree that Deryck shouldn't be producing Sum 41 albums. He should be producing lesser known bands and working on his portfolio as well as gaining experience. You read about Greig and how he tried to get the sounds for Chuck and you can tell he's got a lot of experience.

I don't even really care about solos anymore. It gave Sum 41 the edge over Green Day and Blink-182 (who they are constantly compared to). But Deryck has said he's not a guitar player, but a song writer. So I won't waste time hoping he comes up with a solo like In Too Deep of The Hell Song, because he probably won't. All I hope for now is that he writes songs that rock out and have that old Sum 41 "we're 21, bitches" attitude.

Jeremy wrote:that old Sum 41 "we're 21, bitches" attitude.

but he's almost 29, I'm just saying they are maturing and he wanted to explore new things in UH and I don't think he is done exploring and expanding their sound. You can't do the same thing twice, that how bands fade away, Fat Lip and UH have the same attitude but different sound. If they are happy with what they are doing, I'm happy. UH was a good record, soft and sensative, yet young and agressive

and with the greenday thing, I guess I don't see the comparison because I don't try to find it. A song is a song, and band is a band, no reason to compare the two. Personally I think the Sums are better than greenday ever hope to be. Plus Deryck said UH was inspired by The Beatles' Sgt Peppers.

also I think someone talked about the dress shirt and tie thing, I think its hot. and he was kinda doing that in the chuck era without the tie. and where do you think he got that idea...
http://raymondorado.files.wordpress.com ... 192706.jpg

again JMO

** oh yeah Jeremy do you mean the songs are similar lyrically or melodically?

fenderrocks wrote:

Jeremy wrote:that old Sum 41 "we're 21, bitches" attitude.

but he's almost 29, I'm just saying they are maturing and he wanted to explore new things in UH and I don't think he is done exploring and expanding their sound. You can't do the same thing twice, that how bands fade away, Fat Lip and UH have the same attitude but different sound. If they are happy with what they are doing, I'm happy. UH was a good record, soft and sensative, yet young and agressive

and with the greenday thing, I guess I don't see the comparison because I don't try to find it. Personally I think the Sums are better than greenday ever hope to be. Plus Deryck said UH was inspired by The Beatles' Sgt Peppers.

also I think someone talked about the dress shirt and tie thing, I think its hot. and he was kinda doing that in the chuck era without the tie. and where do you think he got that idea...
http://raymondorado.files.wordpress.com ... 192706.jpg

again JMO

I just said that because bands like Motley Crue still rock out like the always have, even though they're all in their 40s. I know Sum 41 is getting older, but it's weird, because I think their sound went a different way in Underclass Hero. Chuck was way more mature in terms of sound in comparison to Underclass Hero. However, comparing Underclass Hero to All Killer No Filler, Underclass Hero sounds more mature.

As for finding similarities, it just happened when I first heard the song. Sometimes I hear songs and I say to myself "this sounds like I've heard it before." Then I want to know where it was I've heard it before. I'm not necessarily trying to hunt for them. But if someone were to show me a similarity, I can usually see what they mean.

The beginning of Ma Poubelle is the exact same as 1:27 in Being for the Benefit of Mr. Kite! by The Beatles.

EDIT: For similarities, I mean both musically and lyrically but not at the same time. For example:

Musical Similarity: Underclass Hero solo, American Idiot solo

Lyrical Similarity:
"I'm here to represent, the needle in the vein of the establishment!" - St. Jimmy
"We're here to represent, the spit right in the face of the establishment!" - Underclass Hero

yeah you have a point Chuck is mature. Chuck is a great album I guess I should have said somewhere that I have it and UH pretty much tied as my faves. I just don't think UH is a bad as everyone is saying.

I guess I haven't been listening to Green Day that long so I can't pick out things like that
I did go back and listend to Letterbomb and compared it to Take a look at yourself, the intro is similar but I think thats where it ends, to me they lryics and melody are different. and the UH AI solos sound different to me

Deryck wrote this about his thoughts and his life so I don't think he was trying to copy anyone, just so happens that sounds and words can come out similar. To me the album sounds almost Clash like.

Yeah, in general, American Idiot and Underclass Hero are not the same album. They just have a few similarities here and there.

I don't think Deryck deliberately goes out to rip anyone off on purpose, it probably just turns out that way in some cases (Pieces, The Bitter End) unfortunately.

^^ can you tell me what Pieces and The Bitter End resemble, I don't know

fenderrocks wrote:^^ can you tell me what Pieces and The Bitter End resemble, I don't know

Pieces: The Scientist by Coldplay

The Bitter End: Battery by Metallica

There's also a piano version of The Scientist that sounds like the piano version of Pieces. Great songs though.

I heard the piano version when Avril did a cover, it's a really a great song, love the video too
I'll look into Battery, I haven't heard it before

Thanks Jeremy

edit, yeah TBE sounds like Battery, both cool and unique in their own way

I'm a little late to this thread, but I loved anything that Sum 41 has made. I compared this album to a mature version of All Killer No Filler because, to me, that's what they were trying to do. We'll just have to see how much heavier/darker they are on this album coming up.

About the whole thing that they are getting older and more mature I just want say that just because you get older doesn't mean you have to cahnge the music. Just take NOFX for example. They sound pretty much the same since Ribbed which they released 18 years ago. At least musically but they sing songs about more serious topics now. And still they have the really funny songs left like Instant Crassic and She's Nub.

I really don't like that era.
I can deal with dave being gone, but not Greig.
There's Deryck making a poppy album to make sure it sells/gets airplay, and it turned out to be craptastic.
Then, there's the live tone, it fucking sucks.

^

I don't think Deryck did it for better sales and stuff, that would say he's a sellout, which I'm sure he's not considering the things he wrote about and all, that was a risk for him as well.

they need a real producer not deryck. its all about the lyrics when he does it and he slacks on the music.

Jeremy wrote:The Bitter End: Battery by Metallica

If it makes Deryck look any better, Dave WAS responsible for that one and he's admitted to it.

Underclass Hero sucks!

1. Greg Nori definately had more input than was thought.
2. Dave definately had more input than was thought.
3. Too much piano.
4. Not enough catchy riffs.
5. No good solos.
6. Not as punk or fast paced as the other albums.