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Tyler. wrote:I think it would've been their best album since AKNF if Dave came back to the band after UH

Dave's style always created the best riffs. We all know what riffs Deryck created and didn't. The same goes for solos. Sorry, but Tom will never be able to do some of the stuff Dave can for a future reference.

I like Deryck's structure but he is definitely not creative enough with the music. I don't blame him considering he's a singer and mainly rhythm guitarist, but there needs to be more of another creative person in there, that knows more about real lead playing.

i agreed with 100% of what you said, especially (as i've previously stated) about the drinking. they really need to cool it cuz not only are their image and social habits (basically being hermits in their tour bus) changing cuz of it, but they're just getting lazy - 4 years for an album, only 2 new songs of 14 live, no fucking music video still. sobering up would do this band a load of good. but as far as your rant as a whole goes, it was spot on.

I thought that Cone and Steve did help write some of the music on the albums (UH, SBM)

if you watch a lot of the UH videos, Deryck just shuts down Cone's ideas constantly and tells him to play one note for those 4 bars instead of a bass riff.
He had a little better stuff on SBM but barely. And Tom needs to be in there writing all the lead parts. I know Deryck is better than he appears, he can play some hard stuff, but he doesn't have a lead guitarists brain and style, and it's really obvious in the last two albums.

I agree with about everything in this thread. I really think they should have kept Gil Norton around.

Can't really say I would disagree with most of the things said here. Especially when it comes to the drinking. They're not teens anymore so in my opinion they shouldn't act like ones. One reason why I hardly ever watch their update videos anymore is that I felt like they were drinking or doing somehting irresponsible all the time. Now, this is just my view but I thought that it was pretty damn boring.

Some fair points here. Especially about live shows. But people too often forget that it was Greig Nori who wrote 80% songs with Deryck, not Dave. If they need someone back it's him but that's not gonna happen ever, so.

And if I were a rock star, I'd drink and do drugs. Most of you would, so stfu ;D

The first post was great. I totally agree with kevin5064.
And, yeah, I know that I'm talking like a stupid schoolgirl, but Dave shouldn't have gone.

samueeL wrote:Some fair points here. Especially about live shows. But people too often forget that it was Greig Nori who wrote 80% songs with Deryck, not Dave. If they need someone back it's him but that's not gonna happen ever, so.

And if I were a rock star, I'd drink and do drugs. Most of you would, so stfu ;D

To bad they aren't rockstars, to be fair they play in a semi-popular band that had it's peak in popularity ten years ago.

We've already discussed some of these topics before. I will say I was getting annoyed at the setlist not changing up the past while aswell but as of right now, I'm pretty happy we're getting a handful of new songs (besides SBM and Skumfuk) played live. That's all I could ask for.

Tyler. wrote:I don't understand how they can be all like fuck the mainstream fuck everyone except the people that like us but then not hang out heaps with them? (if what you say is right)

I agree, but I don't think it's their type of thing. They say they don't give a fuck about anything besides the fans, ect because they interact mostly with the fans through the crowd during their live shows. It would be nice if they would all hang around afterwards but I don't think it'll happen. I think they'd rather have a party between themselves.

Well some people talked about Deryck's solo career, well it's already begun. Since Underclass Hero.

Stevo describes him in the Underclass Hero Making Of, that Deryck is this "ego" which before there were more of these "ego" kind of people, but now it's just Deryck being that "ego" thus beginning his solo career as producer, songwriter, vocalist, rhythm guitarist, riff writer.

Maybe make more money? Maybe lost his mind? Well he's a genius, kind of fucked up genius though.

He needs a wife.

HugoDisasters wrote:Well some people talked about Deryck's solo career, well it's already begun. Since Underclass Hero.

Stevo describes him in the Underclass Hero Making Of, that Deryck is this "ego" which before there were more of these "ego" kind of people, but now it's just Deryck being that "ego" thus beginning his solo career as producer, songwriter, vocalist, rhythm guitarist, riff writer.

Maybe make more money? Maybe lost his mind? Well he's a genius, kind of fucked up genius though.

He needs a wife.

I'd be more than happy to help him with that. Haha, in all seriousness though, I do have to agree with everything you're saying. I don't even mind him being a producer, I think it's great that he's into all of that stuff. I wish I could be as talented as he is. I mean, the guy is a musician, producer. You name it. I think Deryck becoming the producer again for another album just shows how much he wanted his vision for SBM. (Or we'll say The Sums' vision, whichever..) They wanted to give the fans/themselves the best thing they could ever make and that's what they did. (At least, to some of us.) I have to say, I was a little worried this time around of Deryck producing, only because this album was taking an awful amount of time but it turned out to be more than what I expected, which was beyond the word great.

they've lost the support from island. island doesn't care about rock bands, or sum 41 anymore and in response sum 41 doesn't care to do what the label wants anymore. being in a band like this sucks.

i had a class in school going over the music business and how it's changing and i see it 100% through Sum 41. as long as i get to see them live before they go on hiatus again, im fine.

I don't know what Sum 41's set list is these days, but somebody mentioned how they mainly play singles now as well as new material. That's just something you do as a band. I understand that the band can pick the songs they play live, but I think that because every normal band out there basically caters to fans, they play the singles. They feel obligated to do so. Have you also ever realized that the band has already played those old songs hundreds of times? Songs off of old records may not be played because the band doesn't really enjoy playing them anymore. The reason they probably still play songs like Fat Lip or Still Waiting are because the fans enjoy them. They do their best to incorporate what the casual fan will want to hear, while also playing the songs that they actually want to play (ie. new songs).

Also, someone mentioned not making negative threads about Sum 41.... it's fine to do so. I'm not going to ban someone for voicing their opinion on Sum 41 unless they say something extremely stupid like "Deryck's gay, Cone is a pussy, they suck dick, etc." as their reasoning as to why they are upset with Sum 41. If the guy has a point behind his topic, let him talk.

Here's something I noticed about SBM. I listened to it, and thought some songs were fantastic, or some parts of songs were fantastic. Reason To Believe is AWESOME. It has an interesting intro, and it just flows. Then, it hits this dead spot where it slows down. That "bridge" or whatever you'd call it, is what kills the song, and where the band absolutely proves that they may be over-thinking the song. That's a spot where maybe someone elses input would have been better. Had they just kept the song speedy, it would roll right through and make the album start off with a bang. I mean, really, that opening riff is sick. and then it leads into "man, give me reason to believe..." and you're like HOLY SHIT SUM 41 NOWAYYY THIS IS FUCKING AWESOME.

Reason To Believe up until the bridge seriously made me feel like I had been listening to the band I used to love. It made me fall back in love with them all over again. I was genuinely excited to listen to that album as a result of hearing that opening track. Then, the bridge hits, and it's like... "lol, nevermind".

One thing I'd like to say is that this album would have been much better had it been maybe cut up a bit. I think that I would have personally enjoyed an EP much more than the full album. If they released an EP with just Reason To Believe, SBM, Blood In My Eyes, Jessica Kill, and Skumfuk, I probably would have thought that Sum 41 had their former swag back. However, the album just has so much god damn filler that is so prevalent on every Sum 41 album I've heard. The first few tracks are sick, but then the middle just drags, and then by the end I'm sick of the band and never want to listen to them again.

That's my views regarding the posts I've read in this topic (which weren't a huge amount).

The band at this point have pretty much established themselves in the music industry and have a decent catalogue of songs to choose from to make a decent setlist. In the past, they barely had any material, so they were pretty much forced to play everything. Now it's like they're in a nice "comfort zone" with the song choices. It's easy to pick the singles and the odd fan favorite (ie. No Brains, Mr. Amsterdam). I suppose if I were to go to a Sum 41 show, I'd like to hear the songs I know.

For me, I don't really care much about the setlist as long as the new songs are dominating over their past songs.

In regard to every band member having 100% input, I doubt it will ever happen. Deryck even admitted he was a control-freak, so every idea would have to be run by him anyway. It really surprised me that Deryck even wanted to use one of Tom's songs, which ended up being the title track and first single. Of course, some of it was altered by Deryck, but 90% of the song is pretty much the same as far as I know.

Mothafucking Monster wrote: Reason To Believe up until the bridge seriously made me feel like I had been listening to the band I used to love. It made me fall back in love with them all over again. I was genuinely excited to listen to that album as a result of hearing that opening track. Then, the bridge hits, and it's like... "lol, nevermind".

I agree, that bit definitely has an end of the album feel, not a first track feel at all. I think at 02:42 or so it should've gone back into a fast loud bit.

How many songs are they playing live? People seem to think they don't play enough. In my opinion they should be playing 20-22 if they are the headlining band. They would have no difficulties or complaints about the setlist if they played that many as well.

Sum 41 should really play for 90 minutes if they have a headlining show. I'm not sure how many songs they can play in that time if they continue with the five minute single not bass brdges.

people love to complain when bands re-invent their sound, people love to complain when bands always make the same music
and then there are some bands who have an album that sounds partly like the fans favorite album and also offers a lot of new stuff and some people still need to be annoying and complain

How's Jessica Kill,BIME or Back Where I Belong any worse than No Reason or TNS or what ever you love the most off Chuck?


Deryck owns Sum41 to 100%, he isn't a god at shredding, Chuck isn't the best album in the world and Dave is not Satriani Jr.
get over it

if you want more like Bitter End, go listen to Metallica. But oh yeah SUm41 was that much more creative when Dave was around.
I've never listened to Dave's new stuff, so if there is any epic song he wrote or any epic riff he came up with, feel free to show me